On May 10, 2008, in Hyderabad, one of the largest ever Christian Muslim debate was held. Bro. Jerry was the Christian speaker (From Sakshi: An Apologetics Network in India) and Bro. Imran (Founder President, IREF and International Islamic Scholar) was the Muslim speaker. The topic of debate was- Divinity of Jesus and Messengerhood of Muhammad: Separating Falsehood from Truth. Following is the transcript of the rebuttal by Bro. Jerry Thomas.
Rebuttal by Bro. Jerry
Greetings to you in the precious name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
Bro Imran wasted his first 10 minutes in insulting me. Next 10 minutes in speaking about the Bible. And the last few minutes in speaking about the great Mohammad sahab. Why can’t you speak about Mohammad sahab more than about Jesus or about insulting me? I leave that to him.
Bro. Imran told that he has raised 10 questions and in my lifetime I cannot answer him.
Br Imran, I have prepared Calling to Islam- response to Calling to Islam- Calling to the Feet of Jesus Christ. Take it!
(Bro. Imran says- but he still cannot answer those questions).
Those questions are answered in that. And if you want to know that, you can go to the stall and we have kept a few books to sell it there, and you can buy it there. All the more, we have published it in our Sakshi website. Your questions are already answered.
Now coming to the question. I am taking directly from the question. Where did Jesus say, in the entire Bible for one single time in his direct speech, “I am the second person of Trinity”?
Brother, if you ask shallow questions like this, I can also ask you back.
Where is the word “Tawheed” mentioned in the Quran?
Where is the word for the first classification of Tawheed?
Show me from the Quran: first classification of Tawheed is this, second classification of Tawheed is this, third classification of Tawheed is this. I challenge you. And in your lifetime you cannot.
Br. Imran raised 101 contradictions from the Bible. That has been already cleared. If you want to know, go and see the site “debate.org”.
However, I have prepared exactly 101 contradictions from the Quran. If you want to debate on that, come, we will debate: Bible or Quran. You will not stand.
And then Bro said Quran is the miracle of miracles. I want to show you my brothers today, something.
Mohammad sahab himself appointed a few people as the master reciters of Quran; Ubayy ibn Ka'b and Ibn Mas'ud were one of them. When Uthman compiled those Quran, Ubayy ibn Ka'b and Ibn Mas'ud were not among one of them.
And I have prepared charts:
Jerry shows the charts-
The variations in Ibn Massod's Quran and present day Quran. And I don’t want to speak without evidence. I will quote from Abdullah Yusuf Ali’s book itself. I am quoting from Abdullah Yusuf Ali’s Quran.
In Abdullah Yusuf Ali’s Quran, Surah 33, in footnote number 3674, he says “in some of the Qira’ahs like Ubayy Bin Kaab, the word He is a father of them is also there.
He is a father of them is also there. In the present day Quran, that word is not there.
In Ubayy ibn Ka'b Quran, it is there!!!
Quran is perfectly preserved. Nobody will believe in this at these times brother.
Now if you want to debate, I can have a separate debate on that: Quran or The Bible. You will not be able to stand even for one minute.
Today you have not given me a single point refuting Jesus, the divinity of Jesus. And he can never, never, never do that.
Now, Brother went to Greek mythology to explain Trinity. I can take Oriental Encyclopedia and prove to the brother. In oriental encyclopedia, it says, Tawheed was the belief of the Egyptian magicians. The same Tawheed what brother believes!!!
Now brother spoke about Arius, and Emperor Constantine and he told that it was during the time of Emperor Constantine that the Trinity was established. Get your facts correct before you speak.
Emperor Constantine did not support trinity. He supported Arius. Arius was one of the heretics who denied the divinity of Jesus, like how Bro Imran denies it.
And Emperor Constantine supported it and asked them to reinstate him into the church. But on the day before Arius was reinstated, Arius died; was struck supernaturally by God and he died. That made Emperor Constantine rethink about his position. Later he supported trinity. Not first! First get your historical facts correct.
Now speaking about Tom, Jerry and all, those are personal insults. I will not do that. Because that is fitting more to an entertainment than to an educative program. I will not entertain doing that.
Brother Imran said the ministry of Jesus was limited to the Jews and he said that Jesus called the Samaritan woman as dog.
If only Bro Imran applies the same criteria:
In Surah 28: 46-47, and 32, 33 says Mohammad sahab was sent to people who had no warners before. Who are these people who had no warners before? It was the Arabs! So Mohammad sahab was sent only to the Arabs then! Similarly, Quran is given in Arabic, Surah chapter 2:136, 165-157, and so many verses.
Now Bro Imran may quote that Mohammad sahab was for the entire mankind.
In the same way, I can show you, the ministry of Jesus was first to the Jews and to the entire world.
In Jesus’ own words,
His death was for the salvation of the entire mankind (Matthew 20:28).
Gospel message has to be preached to all mankind (Matthew 10: 18).
His kingdom includes people from all nations (Matthew 8 11-2).
How do we understand that? The Bible itself explains it. The Bible says in the Old Testament and the New Testament that the ministry of Jesus was first to the Jews and then to the entire world.
In fact, his own Quran says that.
Quran says in Surah 3:49 and Surah 43:59, that Jesus’ ministry was limited to the Jews.
However, the same Quran says in Surah 19 verse 21 that Jesus was a sign to all the people.
Bro Imran said,… He again came with the Greek Mythology and spoke about the Holy Spirit indwelling, coming upon Mary.
But he doesn’t know that
In Surah 21: 91, Allah himself said, “we breathe into her our spirit” and
In Surah 66:12, Allah said, “we breath into her our spirit”. So first stick with your Quran, before you abuse the Bible.
Bro Imran said Mohammad sahab became poorer and poorer because of his prophethood. Quran contradicts him.
In Surah chapter 93 verse 96 to 8 says,” Did he not find thee an orphan and give thee shelter and care? We found thee wandering (or in error) and gave him guidance. We found thee in need and made thee independent”, and in some other translations “rich”.
However Sahih Bukhari Volume 3 verse 495 says Allah made the prophet wealthy through conquests. So bro. Imran, first check your hadith before you speak.
Brother Imran applied some scholars’ criteria to say that Mohammad sahab was bigger.
I will show him from his own Quran that Jesus is greater and superior. Right now. Let’s go ahead.
Mother of Jesus
In Surah chapter 3 verse 42 it says Mary is above the women of all nations.
Now the disciples of Jesus
In Surah chapter 3 verse 35 says disciples of Jesus are superior to others. In Surah chapter 5 verse 111, it says disciples of Jesus were inspired.
Followers of Jesus
In Surah chapter 61 verse 14; it says followers of Jesus are the ones who prevail.
Now the titles for Jesus. Before I go to that, let me remind Br. Imran. You with your amazing memory has not responded to the21 questions that I raised. I am not giving it to you, because brother sits like this and thinks he has an amazing memory; then go and respond to that 21 questions. Let me see.
Now let me come to the titles of Jesus.
In Surah chapter 3 verse 45 says “He is a Word from him.”
And the ministry of Jesus
According to Surah chapter 19 verse 27” Jesus started His ministry on the first day from his cradle”. Mohammad sahab had to wait forty years.
Jesus is holy.
He asked “Jesus is tempted”. Jesus is tempted like how the Israelites tempted God in the wilderness yet God did not succumb to the temptations because God is pure and holy. That same pure and holy nature is in Jesus. A
And I quote from Surah 19:19, Jesus is holy.
Adam’s sins are recorded in Surah 236,
Noah’s sins in Surah 11:45,
Mohammad sahab’s sins in Surah 4:102.
Again, Jesus is the author of life, Surah 3: 48 and 5:110. Similar to Allah in Surah 15:28 -29.
Jesus has the knowledge of the unseen (Surah 3:49) and surah 10:20 says Only Allah has the knowledge of the unseen.
And there was a prophet. I am showing you the superiority of Jesus from your own Quran, not from some scholars.
There was a prophet to prepare the way for Jesus, Surah 3:39.
Can you show me any single prophet who had a prophet to prepare his way?
Now Surah chapter 3 verse 15, Christ is above the law.
Now brother Imran, according to your Quran.I don’t want the testimony of your Quran; but for your sake I am giving it.
And finally, let me conclude, my brothers, by saying that Imran miserably failed to prove that Jesus is not God. He could not refute even one point.
He quoted John17:5. Brother Imran.
Your final resortation was into some of my slip of tongue. That was the only thing he could do. Not a single point. 21 points, I have raised. With your amazing memory, I would like to see it answered now.
May the grace of Jesus Christ and His NAME be glorified forever and ever.