After the ban order on 28th and 29th January debate on the Quran at Chennai between Sakshi Apologetics Network and Tamil Nadu Tawhid Jamaat by the Chennai police commissioner, SAN agreed for a private debate at TNTJ premises at their suggestion, as long as it complied with the police order. Since live telecast (web or other means) defies the police order both in letter and spirit, SAN requested TNTJ not to go ahead with web live telecast.
When TNTJ insisted on live telecast, SAN proposed two solutions: (i) either have a private debate without live telecast or (ii) have a public debate with live telecast with police permission. Ignoring both these proposals, TNTJ conducted a program at their head office alleging that SAN ran away from the debates. When the Christians want to abide by the law of this land, why does the TNTJ Muslims want to violate the law of this land? Is this how they teach their community? SAN was ready to go to TNTJ office provided there is no webcast. If there was a webcast and there is a legal problem, it would be only a problem for SAN. Now, TNTJ SITTING at their office, is pretending that SAN had ran away from the debate. If TNTJ was so bold, they should have gone to the venue and fought for it.
Check the evidences below and you will know that TNTJ is finding lame excuses to escape from a public or private debate.
Sakshi Apologetics Network (SAN) and TNTJ had conducted the debate on the topic “The Bible is the Word of God” on January 21 & 22. TNTJ suffered a humiliating defeat though it was a topic that the Christians had to defend (you can watch the entire video on YouTube soon).
Strangely, before the debate on the Quran scheduled on January 28 & 29, on January 27, 2011, joint commissioner of police, south zone, Chennai police, issued a ban order on the debate.
It is intriguing to note that the ban order says “Further, Hindus, Christians, and Muslim organizations (other than TNTJ) object the live telecast of the programme in certain TV Channels.”
We wonder why the ban order specifically mentions “other than TNTJ.” Is it because someone would suspect TNTJ’s hand in it?
Of course, whoever has seen the humiliating defeat of TNTJ would suspect it.
You can view the copy of the ban order here: http://www.sakshitimes.org/images/note.pdf
However:
(a) When TNTJ said the debate can be conducted at their head office, probably thinking that SAN would not accept, SAN agreed it as long as it is a private debate. A private debate would not violate the ban order issued by the police commissioner. We clearly stated that the debate should comply with the police order and agreed for this private debate at their office.
(b) Since webcast is a violation both in letter and in spirit of the ban order, SAN sent an email requesting TNTJ not to go ahead with live telecast.
(c) However, TNTJ insisted on live telecast. Bur for all practical purposes, there is no difference between the public debate and a private debate with a live telecast. There is no essential difference between a public and private debate if there is a live telecast. If one of the reasons of ban was “object the live telecast of the programme in certain TV channels,” will a private debate with a live telecast not be vulnerable to the same risks? Obviously, the answer is yes.
(d) When TNTJ insisted on live telecast, SAN proposed two options: (i) either have a private debate without live telecast or (ii) have a public debate with live telecast but with the appropriate police permission.
(e) Why would SAN debate on the Holy Bible but not debate on Quran? Who should be afraid of this debate? SAN or TNTJ?
(f) Why does TNTJ insist on live telecast when it violates the police order in letter and spirit? Is there an agenda behind this insistence?
(g) SAN was ready to go to TNTJ office provided there is no webcast. If SAN goes to TNTJ office, and if there is a legal or police problem, it would be only a problem for SAN because SAN went to the TNTJ Office.
Why is TNTJ running away from these proposals which comply with the law of this land?
During the last week’s debate, when a SAN resource person quoted a hadith (with a difference reference) TNTJ was caught red handed lying that hadiths is not there when the hadiths was there in their own website. We are not surprised that people who can lie through their teeth about their own hadiths, would lie that and more. Why is TNTJ refusing to accept the implications of the police order and unwilling to accept our reasonable proposals? You decide.
All Emails Follows:
First Email on Jan 27, 2011
———- Forwarded message ———-
From: SAN (INDIA) <sakshi.apologeticsnetwork@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 7:46 PM
Subject: Request official email invite
To: TNTJ Head Office <tntjho5@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho6@gmail.com>, pjtntj@gmail.com
Let the name of Yahweh, the only true name of God upon which all the true prophets have called, who in flesh was called by the name Lord Jesus Christ, be glorified forever and ever. Amen.
Dear Friends at TNTJ,
Further to the assistant commissioners’ order for cancelling the debate on 28th and 29th Jan, and your telephonic offer to have the recorded private debate at your office premise, we request you to officially send us invite by email so that our small friends circle of 25 members apart from resource persons can come for the discussion at the amicable and private place with other terms and conditions being the same while complying to the commissioners’ order.
Looking forward for your invite with the timing when we can meet at your office.
Thanks and regards,
SAN
Reply from TNTJ at 9:01 p.m.
2012/1/27 TNTJ Head Office <tntjho@gmail.com>
அன்புள்ளசான்நண்பர்களுக்கு,
விவாதத்தின்இரண்டாவதுதலைப்பாககுர்–ஆன்இறைவேதம்என்றதலைப்பில்ஜனவரி 28 மற்றும் 29 ஆகியஇருதினங்கள்வித்யோதயாமண்டபத்தில்நடத்துவதுஎனநாம்இருதரப்பும்முடிவுசெய்திருந்தோம்.
காவல்துறையினர்அனுமதிமறுத்ததால்குர்–ஆன்இறைவேதம்என்றதலைப்பில்ஜனவரி 28, மற்றும் 29 ஆகியஇருதினங்களும்குறிப்பிட்டநிகழ்ச்சிநிரலின்படிஎங்கள்தலைமைஅலுவலகத்தில்நடத்திக்கொள்ளலாம்என்றுநாம்பேசிக்கொண்டதைஉறுதிசெய்துஇம்மின்னஞ்சலைஅனுப்புகின்றோம்
பாதுகப்புடனும், எவ்விதஅசம்பாவிதங்களுமின்றிஒவ்வொருதரப்புக்கும்தலா 25பார்வையாளர்கள்மட்டும்அனுமதிக்கப்படுவார்கள்என்பதையும்உறுதிகூறுகின்றோம்.
இடத்தையும், பார்வையாளர்கள்எண்ணிக்கையும்தவிரமற்றஅனைத்தும்ஏற்கனவேசெய்துகொண்டஒப்பந்தத்தின்அடிப்படையில் இருக்கும்என்பதையும்தெரிவித்துக்கொள்கின்றோம். இதையேஎங்களதுஅழைப்பாகஏற்றுக்கொள்ளவும்
உங்களுக்கானமுன்னேற்பாடுகளைசெய்வதற்குஎங்களதுதலைமையகத்திற்குதங்களதுகுழுவினர்கள்நாளைகாலை 8மணிக்குவந்தாலும்உங்களுக்குரியஏற்பாடுகள்தயாராகஇருக்கும்என்பதையும்தெரிவித்துக்கொள்கின்றோம்
இப்படிக்கு,
தமிழ்நாடுதவ்ஹீத்ஜமாஅத்
Reply from SAN at 9:07 pm
2012/1/27 SAN (INDIA) <sakshi.apologeticsnetwork@gmail.com>
Let the name of Yahweh, the only true name of God upon which all the true prophets have called, who in flesh was known by the name Lord Jesus Christ. Amen
Dear Friends at TNTJ,
Thanks for the invite at your office. We hereby confirm our participation for the private debate at your head office.
Thanks and regards,
SAN
However, noting that web telecast would violate the police order and can no longer be considered as private debate, SAN requested TNTJ to stop from live telecast.
Email from SAN at 12:40 p.m.
———- Forwarded message ———-
From: SAN (INDIA) <sakshi.apologeticsnetwork@gmail.com>
Date: 2012/1/28
Subject: Re: அன்புள்ளசான்நண்பர்களுக்கு,
To: TNTJ Head Office <tntjho@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho5@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho6@gmail.com>
Let the name of Yahweh, the only true name of God upon which all the true prophets have called, who in flesh was known by the name Lord Jesus Christ. Amen
Dear Friends at TNTJ,
Further to the email below, in the light of asst. commissioners’ order, we would request you to not to have live web-telecast of tomorrow’s program so that tomorrow’s program as advertised by you.
Regards,
SAN
Reminder from SAN to TNTJ at 8:47 pm after attempts to call them at 7:00 a.m and later speaking to them at around 7:45 a.m.
———- Forwarded message ———-
From: SAN (INDIA) <sakshi.apologeticsnetwork@gmail.com>
Date: 2012/1/28
Subject: Reminder on the web/live telecast
To: TNTJ Head Office <tntjho@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho5@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho6@gmail.com>
Let the name of Yahweh, the only true name of God upon which all the true prophets have called, who in flesh was known by the name Lord Jesus Christ. Amen
Dear Friends at TNTJ,
We are ready to start; however, we are waiting for your email on the web/or other means live telecast. As discussed over the phone, we will start once we have the confirmation that there is no live telecast by web or any other means.
Regards,
SAN
Reply from TNTJ at 8:52 am
2012/1/28 TNTJ Head Office <tntjho@gmail.com>
சான் நண்பர்களுக்கு,
கமிஷனர் அலுவலகத்திலிருந்து எந்த தடையும் இல்லை என்பதை நீங்கள் ஒப்புக்கொண்டதற்கு நன்றி
வித்யோதையா அரங்கம் கிறுஸ்தவ மிஷனரிக்கு சொந்தமான இடமாக இருந்தும் அதில் விவாதம் நடத்த ஒப்புக்கொண்டோம். ஆனால் இப்போது நீங்கள் கூறும் நொண்டிச்சாக்கை பார்க்கும்போது வித்யோதையா அரங்கத்தில் விவாதம் நடக்காமல் போக நீங்களே காரணம் என்பது உறுதியாகின்றது.
பொய்யான காரணம் கூறி விவாதத்தை தவிர்க்க நீங்கள் முயற்சிப்பது வெளிப்படையாக தெரிகின்றது.
பொது இடத்தில் நடத்தினால் அதிக மக்கள் பார்ப்பதால் அதற்கு லைவ் இல்லாமல் போகலாம்.
ஆனால் 25நபர்கள் மத்தியில் நடக்கும் விவாதம்தான் நேரடி ஒளிபரப்பிற்கு அதிக தகுதி படைத்ததாகும்.
எனவே குறித்தபடி நீங்கள் விவாதத்துக்கு வர வேண்டும். இது உங்கள் மீதுள்ள கடமை.
g>
அடுத்த தலைப்புகளில் கமிஷனரை நாம் சந்தித்து பொது இடத்தில் நடத்த அனுமதி பெறுவோம்.
திட்டமிட்டபடி காலை 10மணிக்கு லைவ் நடக்கும்.
எதிர்பார்ப்புகளுடன்,
தமிழ்நாடு தவ்ஹீத் ஜமாஅத்
Proposal from SAN Which Was Ignored by TNTJ (Mails Only) at 9:19 a.m.
———- Forwarded message ———-
From: SAN (INDIA) <sakshi.apologeticsnetwork@gmail.com>
Date: 2012/1/28
Subject: Re: san new
To: TNTJ Head Office <tntjho@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho5@gmail.com>, TNTJ Head Office <tntjho6@gmail.com>, pjtntj@gmail.com
In the name of Yahweh, the only true name of God upon which all the true prophets have called, who in flesh was know by the Jesus Christ. Amen.
Dear Friends at TNTJ,
We are in receipt of your email.
Your email and behavior suggests that it is you who have influenced the police department to get this cancelled( as you have commented in the previous emails and telephonic conversations, you have good influence with police department).
What surprises us most is you who can call commissioners office every now and then, refused to intervene when the debate for Quran is cancelled.
Further, surprisingly, every time when the auditorium for Quran is booked it gets “mysteriously” cancelled. We suspected foul play over there but now the dots are joining together.
Further, you have put posters and banners publicly in the preceding dates in many cities in the state including on Saturday night in violation to the Agreement, probably to provoke people and get this result.
It is also interesting that when we cite “in the light of commissioners” order, you have failed to read the order of which a copy was given to your representatives. If you note that point 5, specifically mentions, that the issue has come because of live telecast of the program in certain TV channels. And a prohibitory order is released hence on all such programs.
In the light of point 5, and our agreement to meet you for a debate with panel members without live telecast, insisting on this point, indicates that this is a ploy of you to come out of the debate.
As we have come forward for a public debate on the Holy Bible, we look forward the same kind of passion for to defend your holy book, if that is ever possible with you.
Looking forward to work with you for a public debate on the topic “is Quran the word of God”.
Thanks and regards,
SAN
Also, see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-SEsvpBbmYc
